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Author | Topic: The bad architects at Core...
Phabius Phodes Member Posts: 327 From:Sao Paulo, SP, Brazil Registered: Jun 2001 | posted 10-27-2001 10:03 AM Iīve been exploring old TR levels for a while, looking at its rooms and construction. There are levels where some some rooms seem misplaced in the physical scenario, although when you play you almost canīt notice that. For example, in Bartolli Hideout from TR2: Remember when you enter the first big internal room with a guy shooting from a balcony? There is a side room to the left with shatterable windows and two dogs, where you can get a medipack (near the statues with blades). This side room is an "outside" room, and you can see the sky and horizon through its grated ceiling. If you continue the level, later youīll get to that room where you need to push a block inside the fireplace to open your path (where you face two baddies and a dog). Well this room is located right on top of that outside room. For an architect point of view, this is very wrong and impossible! But the rooms are there, Iīm sure. Question is - Why the fireplace rooms cannot be seen floating in the sky from the outside room below? Is it enough to texture the ceiling of an open area with transparent textures so you canīt see other rooms floating around it? Iīve played custom levels with some areas where you can actually see parts of other rooms appearing in outside areas. Why it doesnīt happen in that TR2 level??? [This message has been edited by Phabius Phodes (edited 10-28-2001).] IP: Logged
piega Member Posts: 233 From:Netherlands Registered: Dec 2000 | posted 10-27-2001 10:39 AM Hi Fabio, maybe it has something to do with the old editor used for making tombraider 2. There are more bugs in this game. When you are at the monestary with the big statue and stand in front of it there are doors at your left and a trapdoor. When you get to open the doors and look at the ceiling you see that the ceilingtexture moves in the way the textures are moving when you fall in the pit in the first London level. The texturing of the floating island is very bad i my eyes. Although the area is a little organic many textures do not match next to each other. Some texturing in tombraider 3 is worse like the india level. The outside is great but the inside with the floating man with a hole in his belly all textures are the same next to each other with almost no architexture. Just a plain square room. I tryed to use the method you explane above with a mirrorroom but as you said, object can be seen in the air. A pity... Thanks again for your bell Rene IP: Logged
Phabius Phodes Member Posts: 327 From:Sao Paulo, SP, Brazil Registered: Jun 2001 | posted 10-27-2001 12:49 PM Yeah, TR3 has many visual bugs. In Temple of Puna near one of those huge rolling balls, it possible to see that strange texture movement (like in the pit to the street in London). Now that Iīm exploring original TR games again, looking for technical aspects, Iīve been noticing how poor the texture work is in some levels. It makes my levels look like a fine Picasso work! Well, it also explains the texture limit problems I usually have... I also took a look at the Area 51 alien ship. Yes it is much bigger inside than outside. How can that be possible? As we always take that much care in not overlapping rooms... A Flipmap trigger when entering the ship maybe? IP: Logged
Phabius Phodes Member Posts: 327 From:Sao Paulo, SP, Brazil Registered: Jun 2001 | posted 10-27-2001 12:55 PM Oh... What I thought interesting about the Bartolli level case, is that when youīre in the open room and you look at the sky through the grates, you can clearly see the TR2 sky (and if you walk to the corners of the room you can see the top of the horizon), but you donīt see a thing about the rooms which are exactly above you (the ones with the fireplace block and baddies/dog)... [This message has been edited by Phabius Phodes (edited 10-27-2001).] IP: Logged
piega Member Posts: 233 From:Netherlands Registered: Dec 2000 | posted 10-27-2001 02:57 PM Hi Fabio, as for Bartoli's house. Looking into the sky wont show TEXTURES from the room above. It is only objects that are put in the room you see. So i guess only the pushblok would be there but i think that's to far aside in the fireplace to see. I wanted to use this option but my objects popped up. IP: Logged
Phabius Phodes Member Posts: 327 From:Sao Paulo, SP, Brazil Registered: Jun 2001 | posted 10-27-2001 09:41 PM I just took a look at the room again, just curious. Thereīs a big ceiling chandelier in the room above, and a pair of big doors. I donīt think the doors could be seen from the room below but the chandelier certainly should appear, itīs in the middle of of the room. The room with the block also contains some wall candelabrums, but this room is located a bit to the side in relation to the open room below, so these couldnīt be seen anyway. I guess there are visual behavior diferences between the old TR2 editor/engine and this one we use. IP: Logged
GeckoKid Member Posts: 540 From:Hong Kong Registered: Jul 2001 | posted 10-28-2001 02:45 AM if you look in my level, you can see a lot of overlapped rooms. so as the very very very long ladder in the great wall level. a little part of the ladder is overlapped with the room with the 2 moving wheels. ------------------ GeckoKid Interactive my ICQ UIN: 20984785 my MSN: geckokidinteractive@hotmail.com IP: Logged
Michiel Member Posts: 294 From: Registered: Jan 2001 | posted 10-28-2001 04:08 AM if you view a level with trueview (a viewer for tr1-4 levels using Opengl) you see many overlapping rooms. Lara's Home also has it. the second floor with the fireplace is inside the gym, and the swimmingpool hits the outside wall in the garden. But mostly you don't see it. It's only a problem if you want to make a map from a level. IP: Logged
Michiel Member Posts: 294 From: Registered: Jan 2001 | posted 10-28-2001 07:45 AM did you see tr5? the movie before the 13th floor level shows Lara in her catsuit entering the building. She used PISTOLS to go in. And she didn't had the HK gun on her bag. IP: Logged
Phabius Phodes Member Posts: 327 From:Sao Paulo, SP, Brazil Registered: Jun 2001 | posted 10-28-2001 08:28 AM So itīs ok to have overlapped rooms, and even rooms inside rooms, as long as they are not directly connected with each other? If you are going to make a replica, for example, you can just build the rooms as they are (and exactly where they are), and the game will run ok with the TR4 engine? God! The architects at core came from another dimension! IP: Logged
Phabius Phodes Member Posts: 327 From:Sao Paulo, SP, Brazil Registered: Jun 2001 | posted 10-28-2001 10:25 PM *bump* Is there any custom level out there where this situation was created for some reason? (acidentally or on purpose?) IP: Logged
Qudlatopec Member Posts: 35 From: Registered: Jul 2001 | posted 10-29-2001 01:00 AM You can overlap rooms because TR engine does not display all rooms at the same time. Just the room Lara is in and those in the neigbourhood. Try building one room inside another but connect those two not directly but with the U shaped corridor... Bad architects.. and engineers! Check UFO object in TR3 Nevada level. From the outside it is rather small. When you get inside through the entrance corridor you will notice the interior is much much bigger than you saw from outside. IP: Logged
aktrekker Member Posts: 588 From:WA, USA Registered: Apr 2001 | posted 10-29-2001 01:24 AM I seem to remember someone doing that to create a snow effect. Don't know how well it works, but it used overlapping rooms. If you use search on "make snow" you should find the thread. IP: Logged
the_last_frustration Member Posts: 2020 From:Northern Ireland Registered: Mar 2001 | posted 10-29-2001 01:06 PM i have a headache. IP: Logged
piega Member Posts: 233 From:Netherlands Registered: Dec 2000 | posted 10-30-2001 10:34 AM Hi Fabio, i used this in my Black Palace level. There is a pharos knot on a temple in a large waterroom. Under it you find an underwaterdoor. You can swim up and the swimmingcorridors are actually in the templeroom itself! This works only with a normal room and a waterroom. You cant use this trick with 2 normal rooms because you get collisiontroubles with doors. If you want i send you the project. Mail me. Rene IP: Logged
Phabius Phodes Member Posts: 327 From:Sao Paulo, SP, Brazil Registered: Jun 2001 | posted 10-30-2001 10:42 AM Hi Rene, check your mail. ---------- Aktrekker, The snow trick is based on overlapping a water room with a normal "dry" room. Lara has access to the normal room only. Those bubbles in the water room will appear in the normal room and will look like snow (well, almost like snow...) IP: Logged
KingSpyder Member Posts: 81 From: Registered: Feb 2001 | posted 10-30-2001 11:16 AM quote: Originally posted by Phabius Phodes: Is there any custom level out there where this situation was created for some reason? (acidentally or on purpose?) Yes! And it was delibrate. It's in a level I have yet to release. Basically, I was trying to make a corridor through a water room that she could see out of into the water room. I wanted water on all four sides of the corridor and, for some reason, she kept falling through the floor into the water room below. The only way I could get it to work was to double all the necissary rooms, remove the water from the second room below, and overlap and connect where needed. It's a bit hard to explain, but it works and looks great! ------------------ KingSpyder KingSpyder@thefreesite.com KingSpyder's World Doctor Who: The Transcripts Project & The Original Tomb Raider Conversion Project IP: Logged

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